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2026.10.05 | TB | Consumer | Indian Luggage & VIP Industries

原标题：Indian Luggage Industry & VIP Industries – Former Senior Executive, Supply Chain at VIP Industries Ltd

#consumer

Third Bridge · 2026-10-05

Client-led • 26 Sep 2026

Companies: 507880 IN, AMZN US, 1910 HK

Expert Former Senior Executive, Supply Chain at VIP Industries Ltd

Agenda

Introduction

Client 1 [00:00:54]: The overall purpose is to understand what is happening in the luggage sector, particularly focusing on VIP Industries, especially considering the recent management change and whether it can reclaim its past glory.

Questions

00:00:54] VIP made multiple mistakes post-pandemic. It created excess capacity in Bangladesh in soft luggage while the industry moved to hard luggage. It ended up discounting Aristocrat very heavily online and also diluted brands such as VIP and Skybags to gain market share in the online space. It also built sizeable inventory despite not getting very good sales. All this was done because the company's management layer was not very strong. Are we missing anything else?

Expert [00:01:54]: Not really. These are part of some of the biggest things that have happened. Apart from that, the one other thing that has also been happening is that there have not been very many successful products that have worked in the market. What is also happening and that is not entirely VIP to blame but probably VIP is also a party to that, in that the entire pricing of the industry is being driven downward. ASPs are falling YoY. I was just thinking that in VIP, we used to have a product which used to be a two-wheeler, soft luggage, external trolley product, which used to be sold at INR 1,600-1,700 ASP. Today, a PC product is being sold at INR 1,600, 10-12 years down the line. Commodity prices haven't become cheaper. ASPs are being driven downward very, very fast. As a consequence, you can see it on the balance sheet of all the companies. Margins have narrowed.

Client 1 [00:03:27]: Why do you think these ASPs have come down?

Expert [00:03:31]: Because nobody is making any product that is standing out, that is drawing in consumer. It is only price that is selling. There is no work on marketing. There's no advertising. There's no brand-building. Nothing is happening.

00:03:49] Have players such as Mokobara and Uppercase been marketing?

Expert [00:03:56]: They have been marketing, but they are a drop in the ocean in terms of the sales that they do.

Client 1 [00:04:01]: INR 200 crore in INR 11,000 crore.

Expert [00:04:04]: What is their impact on the entire industry space in terms of creating differential products and the ability to influence the industry? They are far, way off in order to do any kind of impact right now. They might be doing their own brand some good. In the overall industry scale, they are not too important at this point in time, maybe probably in future but not right now.

00:04:32] In that context, do you think VIPs are permanently diluted as a brand, including VIP and Skybags positioning? Has the bulk of the discounting been in Aristocrat and Safari only?

Expert [00:04:50]: No, it has happened in all brands, not only VIP, Skybags, every brand. Even American Tourister has come down a lot in terms of pricing. It is not only VIP and Aristocrat. I don't know whether you have access to data of VIP as a brand. VIP also doesn't spell out what its brand sells, but it doesn't sell much. If you go to Amazon or if you go to Flipkart, you look at the bestsellers in any category, you would not see a VIP brand product there. You might see a product from VIP Industries, but you won't see a VIP brand product there. VIP as a brand is more or less dead. Skybags still command some kind of a recall into some kind of TOM score.

00:06:08] Do you think, with the new management, most launches have been VIP-brand only? There are coffee and laptop holders right outside the suitcase, easier-to-carry, smaller-size bags, smaller than cabin size as well. Can any of these revive the brand?

Expert [00:06:27]: Your answer again lies in going to Amazon and Flipkart and trying to see whether any of those products appear in the bestsellers, but my knowledge, they don't.

Client 1 [00:06:42]: Our understanding was that VIP was pushing Aristocrat online, and the latter was pushing VIP and Skybags offline. That does not seem to be the case.

Expert [00:06:57]: In today's world, it doesn't happen. Consumer checks out online or buys online doesn't happen, but there is a significant online presence for everybody. I might finally decide not to buy online because I more probably want the touch-and-feel experience. I buy from a local shop or go to a store. I will definitely look around online for prices, for the kind of product that is available. The research is done online. There is no hiding away from that fact. You might choose which is your point of purchase, but your point of research is online. Whatever is online, the consumer knows. Even if you launch a product offline and don't sell it online, it is all the more reason that it won't sell. Those are people who actually don't know about that product. How many physical presence doors do they have? In any case, say, Safari sales is about 50% online. VIP sale is also about 40-42% online. I assume, if you remove, say, CSD sales and institutional business out of it, your more consumers are online than they are offline. If you are launching a product only for offline, chances of success are limited.

Client 1 [00:08:32]: I think offline and modern trade are shrinking. General trade is not growing as a channel.

Expert [00:08:39]: No. Again, it is counter-intuitive. Modern trade is again driven by price. The bigger players are Vishal Mega Mart, DMart, Reliance. Nobody focuses on premium or mass premium. Everybody is focusing on value, the bigger chains there. Even if you want to sell VIP, Skybags, what is your outlet to sell? Then it is only general trade and your own stores. Over the years, you have created a strategy which is more online-driven. You have put your monies in online. Today, your performance marketing takes away a hell lot of money. You don't have any more money to spend on brands. Your GT and your stores are suffering. Your ability to sell higher-priced products is actually taking a hit unless and until you want to sell higher products through online and drive up ASPs again, it is going to be very, very difficult.

Client 1 [00:10:07]: If ASPs were to drive up, would that happen only through online?

Expert [00:10:16]: I don't believe that there are not enough consumers who are willing to pay a higher price for a good product, which is well-designed with better materials, with better features. They're willing to pay the price. The point is, where are they going to see it? You have to make the product, you have to make it reach out to them and you have to do it at a price which commands a good margin for you. The point is that the biggest stage today is online, but if you're not doing it there, where are you going to do it?

00:10:50] You mentioned that VIP and Safari are already struggling, and all legacy brands are having some issues. D2C is a very small drop in the ocean. Where is the share moving?

Expert [00:11:22]: No, D2C is not a small share. I did not say D2C. I'm saying D2C-exclusive brands that started are very small today. Even if you are talking about VIP, Safari, 45-50% of their sales come from D2C from online. That is direct-to-consumer.

Client 2 [00:11:43]: By D2C, I meant the newer brands such as Nasher Miles, Mokobara, Assembly, etc.

Expert [00:11:53]: For them, it is going to be a struggle for a while unless and until they reach a scale. They currently don't have the scale right now. For example, if you talk about any company, the units these people sell in a year, Safari or VIP probably sells in a month. That is the kind of scale that they have. Think of the pricing power and everything else that these guys have. Despite all that, their gross margins are coming down and their EBITDAs are shrinking, the pricing pressures they have on their front and they are imposing it on the entire industry. Somewhere, the D2C brands also have to react at a certain level. For example, if somebody's input costs go up and they want to take a price increase, they have think be very careful in order to do that because they know their competition and the bigger ones are not going to take it probably.

00:13:06] How do the unit economics differ between these brands and D2C brands such as Mokobara and Nasher Miles?

Expert [00:13:30]: Unit economics is probably the same. It is just that at a gross margin level, the bigger brands are positioned in order to get a higher gross margin. The point is that they are using their volume as leverage in order to work with lesser gross margins than the smaller brands would be comfortable with. The challenge here is that if you look at the larger chunk of sale, which is currently the online sale, even though at a unit economics level, at a CM2 level, it makes sense, but the moment you add performance marketing to that, you are gone.

Client 1 [00:14:16]: What percentage of ASP would this performance marketing be?

Expert [00:14:21]: Performance marketing could be anywhere. If I am not wrong, it would be anywhere between 15% to 20%. Plus, if you have the cost of doing business in these portals, that is again a 15-20%. Where do you have any margin left?

Client 1 [00:14:42]: When you say cost of doing business, do you mean storage, fulfilment, logistics, etc?

Expert [00:14:47]: Yes, that's what the portal charges you. Even if you do drop ship and don't use theirs, you will be landing up a similar cost.

00:14:55] Our understanding was that after the pandemic, PP [polypropylene] prices dropped down. PP and technology also moved from PC [polycarbonate] to PP, which is why the ASPs have declined over time. Is this correct?

Expert [00:15:17]: No, that is not the right understanding. Yes, there was a movement away from PC to PP. PP was not trusted earlier and it was seen as a poor man's product because most of it was used to build hard suitcases. You can say there was an image change or an acceptance in terms of a PP upright or a trolley that came in the Indian consumer because all the companies, when they saw that their supply line from China was getting restricted in what could they manufacture in India, manufacturing soft luggage was not very easy because it was extremely labour-intensive. Getting consistency in India in terms of manufacturing quality was very difficult. The only other thing that could be manufactured at scale with decent quality and with consistent quality was PC and PP. Hence, PP came in because it was a lower-priced product. The price at which PP was available then and the price at which PP is available now, polypropylene costs are hugely different. Input costs, commodity costs are not same what it was during COVID. They are in multiples now. Prices have still gone down. You can attribute some of it to efficiencies in terms of scale but not that much.

00:17:05] I want to understand Safari's operating margins after the pandemic and VIP's before the pandemic. Now, because ASPs are falling over time, their gross and EBIT margins have also suffered. Can they go back to those margins? Do you think those margins are not achievable at these prices?

Expert [00:17:47]: As I said, it has nothing to do with scale. Whatever efficiencies your scale could give, you have already juiced it out. You have built it into price. You have built it further. The point now is unless and until you correct your prices, your EBIT margins or your gross margin is not going to come back.

Client 1 [00:18:11]: You're saying that only with prices going up in the industry, the returns and margins can come back.

Expert [00:18:20]: Yes, that is the only way. There is no other way. There could be a certain relief if the commodity market cools down. If the Gulf war is no longer there, if the Ukraine war is no longer there and the commodity prices become benign again, then we could see a 4-5% improvement in EBITDA margins, but that would again be lying to yourself. The moment another thing hits you, you will again be back in the doldrums.

Client 1 [00:18:54]: Is it Safari driving this decline in ASP for the industry and not Samsonite and VIP?

Expert [00:19:05]: Safari is driving it, but everybody else is participating. There is no reason for everybody else to participate. It's not that if Safari is the lowest-priced product, then everything Safari will sell. Safari has always been the lowest-priced product. It has never been the leader. What has changed today? What has changed today is that the other brands are not making good-enough products and are not spending on marketing. Nobody is spending. In the eyes of a new consumer, you are no different from Safari.

Client 1 [00:19:43]: This has become so commoditised that any cabin bag which sells for about INR 2,500 has to give a very different kind of brand value, which is not there at all today.

Expert [00:19:55]: The other way of thinking for the consumer is, say, for example, if I approach a consumer now and say, "Why don't you buy a product at INR 4,000? This is made of better material. It is good. It is going to last long." Consumer will say, "I buy an INR 1,500 product. I do, say, probably five to six trips with it. It lasts as long as it lasts. Then, I throw it away and buy another one because it is so cheap." Then the consumer doesn't look about brand. He or she waits for the Big Billion Days or Great Indian Festival on Amazon and buys a deal product. It has to be, where is the brand?

00:20:40] Multiple PE funds have bought out the promoter stake in VIP, and they are making a lot of changes. They brought in new individuals in the top management. The managing director is now Mr Atul Jain, who has come from Orient Fans. Do you think that this is a cause for concern?

Expert [00:21:07]: Of course, it is a cause of concern because if you ask me, this is a very typical industry, which has traits of FMCG as well as FMCD without being either of them. It has a unique way of operating. This is an industry where most of the industry had been offline for a very, very long time in an environment where online has been the primary driver for many other industries. Unless and until you have that perspective, so today, if you realise, this is a category which is a volumetric product. Your cost of doing business in terms of storage, logistics is going to be high. The moment you go to online sale, the last-mile economics costs you a lot, a lot more than any other industry. The more your online sales increase, the more there is going to be a pressure if you're operating at the same gross margin and there is a cost of doing business and there is a performance marketing which you have to do. If this becomes the lion's share of your business, your overall margin from that channel is going to be very, very limited. Where are you going to supplant it from? You either drive up your ASPs from there and gain enough margin pool or you drive up your sales in the offline channels where you earn better margins. None of the companies are doing that and VIP also is not doing that. How is the recovery going to come?

00:23:15] Can the new team grow or turn around this business successfully?

Expert [00:23:25]: I cannot comment on the individual or the team. I can see what is going on from the outside. For example, we have all been discussing prices coming down, brands not being consequential, not spending on marketing. What does the team go and do? They revive the Alfa brand and launch it, which is the lowest of the lowest brands. Directionally, what are you trying to do? You are trying to sell at the bottom end of the market.

Client 1 [00:23:59]: You're saying they have revived Alfa.

Expert [00:24:02]: Yes, Alfa is available online. If your management thought is that I will revive the brand in my portfolio after having lost the best brand, Carlton, which had been built so painstakingly, I take it to INR 100-plus crore, you lost that brand and your answer is to launch Alfa, then you are very sure which way the company is headed.

00:24:38] What are the metrics we should closely monitor to understand whether the turnaround is happening decently or not?

Expert [00:25:03]: 2-3 things are very, very difficult for VIP Industries. Their overall gross margins have been under pressure, one. That is, of course, you would be looking at. Second is manpower costs. They were about 2-3% higher than the industry and they have gone even further now. If I'm not wrong, they are currently in the 13-14% range. They are currently about 5-5.5% off from the industry. That's a big hit. Of course, your promotion of the bigger brands and the pricing that they are trying to do, so they are currently under pressure. They are continuing to operate the Bangladesh plant because there are a lot of assets there. There is a lot of obligation there. You are having to operate that plant. That plant is, what should I say, a drag on the business. Unless and until they can find a way of utilising that capacity or shutting it down, it will continue to be a drag on the business.

Client 1 [00:26:22]: Do you not think that soft luggage will make a comeback?

Expert [00:26:30]: Unlikely, very unlikely in terms of upright trolleys, but every other category in soft luggage is doing well in terms of, say, whether you talk about passenger bags, whether you talk about backpacks, whether you talk about duffels, those are the markets that are growing. It is only that the soft luggage, soft variant of the trolleys are not going to sell with luggage as earlier.

Client 1 [00:26:59]: Is the Bangladesh facility still an asset for the so-called backpacks and duffels?

Expert [00:27:06]: Yes, it is an asset. Again, the Bangladesh facility, as far as I know, was not able to manufacture any of the premium products. Any kind of backpack, which is, say, more than INR 1,500-1,800 kind of a product, Bangladesh was not able to manufacture. I'm not sure about the status that is now. The products that I have seen in the market of VIP, the better ones are all made from China.

Client 1 [00:27:37]: A lot of assembly parts go from China to Bangladesh. Is it the same supply chain?

Expert [00:27:47]: Yes, it is the same supply chain. The labour arbitrage is the one thing that you are just using.

00:27:55] Safari created a channel conflict with the offline players because it went into online very heavily and also discounted, which the general or modern trade was not able to match. Is that the right understanding?

Expert [00:28:15]: To a very large extent, yes. Also, the fact is that Safari has, in an effort to pacify the offline channels, been offering the same pricing to the offline players from time to time to pacify them and keep a hold on them, which VIP is struggling to do because they don't have the fiscal space to do it.

00:28:50] VIP wanted to liquidate its slow-moving inventory in one go. That was also done mostly online. Do you think VIP will be able to mend its relationship with offline in one year?

Expert [00:29:10]: It is very difficult. VIP used to be present in, I would say, 85-90% of stores that used to sell branded luggage. In about 35-40% of those stores, it was exclusive. Today, there is hardly any store which is exclusive to VIP and probably that number has shrunk from 85-90% to lesser because today, there are brands available where the retailer can survive as a retailer without selling any brand from VIP. It will be a Herculean task to gain back that share in that channel.

Client 1 [00:30:02]: Who has taken that place? Who would have taken that place? Is it Safari?

Expert [00:30:06]: Safari has taken, Kamiliant has taken to a certain extent, American Tourister has taken. Uppercase is available offline.

Client 1 [00:30:18]: Kamiliant and American Tourister are Samsonite brands only. We don't see significant growth in Samsonite numbers either.

Expert [00:30:25]: No, they haven't grown significantly, but their presence has increased in the offline channels because of the space that VIP has vacated. It is not that they would have grown because directionally, the offline channel is not growing much.

00:30:50] As you mentioned, post-pandemic, the mid-premium segment migrated to mass, but some customers also went to the premium level, who are discerning and have higher pricing power. In the case of the premium segment, who has benefited?

Expert [00:31:06]: Samsonite. To a certain extent, Mokobara and Uppercase. Mokobara came in and built a brand at that price point only.

00:31:16] Now, VIP has a mid-premium positioning, where the market has been most affected. If VIP has to launch, it has to be either in the same or premium segment. In premium, it does not have any brand as such because Carlton went away. Where do you think the new positioning of the brand would move?

Expert [00:31:40]: It depends whether you are trying to revive VIP or you are trying to get a new brand in.

Client 1 [00:31:51]: Revive VIP.

Expert [00:31:54]: If you were to revive VIP, you can't just position it as a premium brand out of the blue because it has a legacy, it has a history. Consumers know what it stands for, even if they don't buy it. They know what it stands for you. You are not going to be able to change it overnight just by an advertising campaign. It doesn't happen like that. For VIP, it is the end of the road. It will remove. I don't think today's Gen Z or millennials even have VIP in the consideration set when they go out to buy luggage. It is going to be extremely difficult. Skybags, to a certain extent, yes. I don't think they have any other option but to launch a new brand at the higher premium end to create a presence there. Otherwise, they are not going to be able to go up the price ladder. It's going to be very difficult.

00:32:55] In this context, we have seen brands such as Mokobara and Uppercase. However, the revenues are less than INR 200 crore, while Samsonite has also not grown. Would it be right to say that online units sold well, but revenue growth was not significant across all segments?

Expert [00:33:22]: Yes, that is true. Online, the volume sales have grown much faster than values.

Client 1 [00:33:30]: Would you know the delta between the two, roughly, over the last five-year or three-year period?

Expert [00:33:34]: The period after COVID would be a misnomer because growth is actually, the first three years, we had to go back to the 2019 levels. That is actually irrelevant.

00:34:24] The PE interest in this segment has not gone down significantly. New competitors who are white-labelling from China continue to come and sell online. Do you foresee some of these guys having to shut shop?

Expert [00:34:45]: I don't know that, but I can tell you from some information that I have. This is personal information. You might want to verify it. The interest of PE investors has significantly gone down. There is not much money available for this industry. Right now, it's a wait-and-watch for this industry because the larger players are bleeding. They don't see enough scale. The other pressure is that most of the investor money is now moving to deep tech. People are not allocating enough capital to this industry for investment. Zouk has made a bit of a play in terms of ladies' handbags and, to a certain extent, passenger bags but not in the exact luggage scenario. The only brand that has launched probably in the past three to four months is Escape Plan with HRX.

Client 1 [00:36:47]: Have all of them come in luggage?

Expert [00:36:51]: Yes, they have come in luggage. They launched in July, but they had a very big July. After that, they literally are down to, say, 25% of what they did in July. Sustenance will be a problem because they are again going for the lowest rung.

Client 1 [00:37:13]: They are also going for the lowest rung. HRX is also going at the mass level only.

Expert [00:37:18]: HRX launched PP uprights at INR 1,499 cabin size. That's their pitch. Viability will be a challenge for them.

Client 1 [00:37:31]: In this context, VIP is very well-capitalised. It doesn't have significant balance sheet risk. Debt has also become manageable. If these guys get into difficult positions, do you think VIP will benefit?

Expert [00:37:48]: I don't know why you are saying VIP is well-capitalised. Whatever capital infusion happened has already been absorbed. The only thing that they have done is that they have probably cleared out their inventory. Their debt continues to be significant. Their cost of servicing debt on the P&L account has not gone down.

Client 1 [00:38:09]: No, last week the company announced that it is raising INR 500 crore more in equity.

Expert [00:38:16]: Probably, but that's fine. They could raise in equity, but that will go to the owner. How will it flow into the company?

Client 1 [00:38:24]: No, the company will issue new shares.

Expert [00:38:27]: They will issue new shares. We will have to see who goes in and buys those shares and at what price. The other thing is that from what I know.

Client 1 [00:39:43]: While the company's old inventory is liquidated, it still needs funds for managing or running its day-to-day business. Just because there are less funds, they can't introduce new products, can't invest in marketing, etc.

Expert [00:39:57]: You can't. When you make a new line of products, there is an additional capital required in order to build inventory. You're not going to get that.

00:40:11] Safari has significantly increased its own manufacturing capacity to, I think, 10 lakh pieces per month. Samsonite also increased it two years back. VIP, too, has its own capacity. Is this a big advantage that the incumbents have?

Expert [00:40:28]: Yes, it is definitely an advantage that incumbents have because one is that today, the ability to manufacture products at a very similar scale to China at a very similar pricing to China is definitely an advantage. Any other player would either have to set up their own manufacturing, but they would not be able to reach that scale or you buy it, do third-party manufacturing on which you have to give a margin, which eats into your gross margin or your EBITDA. Whichever way, it is definitely an advantage to have your own capacity for a category, which is today 60-65% of your business. If you have the ability to make it in-house, then it saves you a lot of costs.

00:41:25] The new players such as Mokobara, HRX, Rare Rabbit, Uppercase, etc, don't have their own capacity. Will they still be able to compete with these guys or because they play in a different market, are they not to worry about?

Expert [00:41:39]: Uppercase has its own manufacturing. Mokobara doesn't. Mokobara probably will not have because Mokobara doesn't play in the cheaper segment of the market.

00:42:04] What is the capacity utilisation at the top three players? VIP created more capacity than it was required. Safari anticipated much higher growth and created capacity ahead of the curve. Has Samsonite also done the same?

Expert [00:42:28]: No, Samsonite has not done the same. VIP and Safari are different from Samsonite because Samsonite has shifted its worldwide hard luggage manufacturing base to India from China. If they don't sell in India, they will export. They don't have a utilisation challenge vis-à-vis VIP and Safari.

Client 1 [00:42:58]: Is there any reason how they found that the Indian cost structure to be lower than China's, given that China is the luggage capital of the world?

Expert [00:43:05]: No, not just because of cost. They also figured that they placed the bet that the supply chains on China would be fraught with risk going into the future. You never know. Suddenly, there could be a breakdown in US, China and there could be tariffs, there could be sanctions and then you could not be able to sell made-in-China products anywhere, which is why they consciously made that shift to India and, to a certain extent, to Vietnam. This they made just post-COVID, not right now. They have been exporting from India for a very long time.

Client 1 [00:43:56]: Has Safari and VIP created capacity ahead of the curve?

Expert [00:44:06]: Yes, yes, they are ahead of the curve right now.

Client 1 [00:44:12]: For Safari to use its capacity, it would make more sense to sell at a discount or sell at a lower cost and focus on volumes.

Expert [00:44:20]: Yes, which is exactly what it is doing.

Client 1 [00:44:23]: VIP will also have that pressure because its funding is also not very clear right now.

Expert [00:44:33]: VIP has doubled the pressure. One, you have to utilise the hard luggage capacity and then you have overcapacities in Bangladesh also. There is a double whammy for VIP.

Client 1 [00:44:44]: Do you have any idea of the utilisation of capacity at Safari and VIP? What is it at current levels?

Expert [00:44:51]: No, I don't have a number on that.

00:44:58] At what rate do you think the luggage sector's trajectory can grow in the next five years?

Expert [00:45:10]: Considering that travel is trended to grow at 6-6.5%, air travel, I'm saying, air travel is expected to grow at 6-6.5% over the next 5-10 years. The economy is also slated to grow at 6-6.5%. Usually, the luggage industry delta has been somewhere between 1.5% to 2% in terms of value of the GDP growth. Anywhere between 10-12% is what you should be able to expect in terms of value, unless and until there is further accretion in ASPs. If ASPs further go down, then probably the values won't come up to those numbers.

Client 1 [00:46:09]: In that 10-12%, which brands do you think will grow faster and slower than this rate?

Expert [00:46:17]: Safari will grow faster, definitely. To a certain extent, Aristocrat will grow faster.

Client 1 [00:46:24]: Which is VIP's brand?

Expert [00:46:27]: VIP's brand, but the point is that it will probably eat up its own brands. At a company level, it might not grow as fast, but Aristocrat will continue to grow because it is the most supported brand in terms of product, pricing, etc. Kamiliant will grow. Any other brand that can operate at that price point with a degree of scale can grow. I don't think there is any other brand that can operate with the scale these guys operate at that price point. These are the three brands that will continue to grow at a pace that is faster than the industry.

Client 1 [00:47:16]: Not Mokobara?

Expert [00:47:16]: Not Mokobara. Mokobara will grow but not at a very frenetic pace. The period of frenetic growth phase is over.

Client 1 [00:47:30]: Is it because the base is still very low?

Expert [00:47:36]: No. Their challenge is they are an online D2C brand. Now, they have not been able to make the transition to offline very well. Their offline sales are not a very big hit. They have opened stores, but their throughput is not… How many standalone stores, EBO stores can you open at that kind of brand sales? Plus, the other thing is that they have now ventured into exports with their brand. They are building the entire supply chain in different countries. That's a pressure on their finances. Given all that, I don't think they will have the space to invest significantly in their brand and continue to grow at a very fast pace. They will have the steady pace of growth from now on probably and focus more on increasing efficiencies and becoming a much more cost-efficient company to turn profitable.

00:48:51] Has there been any culture change after the VIP management change? You mentioned in your previous call that its HR officer was handling sales, highlighting the lack of management depth at the top. In terms of the new management or the new owner settling in, how has the experience been so far?

Expert [00:49:34]: I don't think much has changed because the value at the top is not there. What are you trying to revive? Your online is working. You want to revive your offline side of the business and offline works on relationships. It doesn't work on systems and processes. Of course, it does. It is hygiene. It's sufficient but not necessary. Then again, it is the relationship. If you want to revive, if you want to go back to a store and say, "Boss, you are 100% VIP, what happened? Can you give us another chance?", that is going to happen only through relationship. That is not going to happen through sales sides. Unless and until you are from the industry, people know you, people trust you, it is going to be very, very challenging.

Client 1 [00:51:36]: Today, Samsonite India, he is a former VIP Sales Director. Promoter of Safari is a former managing director of VIP only. That way, there have been very good people from VIP.

Expert [00:51:48]: Safari sales head is also a former VIP guy.

Client 1 [00:51:52]: How long ago did he join Safari?

Expert [00:51:56]: Long back. He joined Safari, I think, about 8-9 years back. He's grown within Safari, but he is an ex-VIP.